R&R should be kept. It’s hilarious but can be good. I like it, but it would do with a bit of policing.
If you were a god, you would, among other things, have to decide what kind of a god you wanted to be. Would you want to be an all-seeing god who interacts with your creations, is recognizable to them and communicates with them?
“Hey, that guy over there. Isn’t that god?”
“Yeah, sure. I seen him on TV the other night.”
“Hey, he just made my cheeseburger disappear! Shit, now it’s on his table – and he’s eating it, the bastard!”
“THOU BITEST ME!”
Or would you like to be an all-seeing god who acts in mysterious ways and who is unknown to his creations, with whom he does not communicate?
“Do you ever wonder about god?”
“No, not really… shit! My cheeseburger just vanished into thin air!”
“Maybe that was god’s will.”
“It’s a mystery. I wonder where it went?”
“No use praying, he never answers.”
In the first case, if you knew what god looked like and where you might be able to find him you could hunt him down and punch him in the nose for taking your cheeseburger. Or you could find him and thank him for saving you from saturated fats and excessive calories. God wanting to be just part of the world he created has its good points and its bad ones.
On the other hand, if you didn’t know what god looked like and could not communicate with him, you couldn’t really know when he was acting among his creations or when it was just chance. You certainly couldn’t walk up to him and give him a piece of your mind. You could contact him – he would receive your message – but he would never respond. God could work in mysterious ways and his creations would have no recourse.
It seems to me that Gus and Christine, as gods of the Oriented, came into this project with the first point of view. They have printed their photographs for all to see; they have given links to personal Web sites; they have given several ways to contact them and they respond. If the world were a soft a furry place, I would say that this was noble and just. Unfortunately, this is a na
mercy me! there is someone out there that speaks with the voice of reason. I thought fer sure all dem ex-pats speakings were foul-mouthed, psyko killahs.
well blow me down!
from the depths of the murky murphy.
Rants and Raves definitely has a place.
Registration brings a little self disipline to users. Someone apart from the administrators probably knows who they are in person. The information required for registration is hardly invasive and I support the need for an email address. If the Taiwan authorities are feared, then fear that the IP’s are recorded, for both registered and unregistered users. Then move back to a dialup connection to avoid having a constant IP address.
When postings become a bit tiresome I skim or skip them. If they said something useful I could notice it in someone else’s response.
My suggestion is that unregistered users be given a forum without topics or threads. There they can rant and rave to their hearts content, anonymously, without responsibility, and possible obscurity. Unregistered users could also have access to help forums with the administrators free to move anything that is unhelpful opinion (as they could for registered users). On the other hand if people want serious help, the moderator could suggest that they have the courtesy to register.
As long as registration is quickly available no serious contributor would be inconvenienced.
So we could have Rants and Raves, Registered and Unregistered or, more simply an General Unregistered forum.
As for moderation, as long as it is not illegal or actionable, it should be able to be said. Moderation is for keeping discussion in the right forum. Here administration can act firmly and few would object. Personal attacks are simply tiresome.Maybe those who feel the need could use the personal email facility and save the rest of us from having to mentally filter it. Or maybe unhelpful postings could be moved to a suitable forum, where the discussion as to whether they are really objectionable, or not, could continue.
I was surprised to see that the mormon issue was deemed controversial. I found it interesting.
The administration has enough to do without having to write their own stred wrds dictionary, so why shouldn’t they use something of the shelf. Maybe when they get really bored they could delete the odd word from it. I think the objectors have already demonstrated that it does not eliminate the means to adequately express themselves.
If administrators want to post their opinions: Why not! If they have the courage to identify themselves; congratulations! They have the same (or better) access to hide in multiple registration. If there was no evident censorship, beyond the illegal and actionable material, no-one could fear that the discussion was being hijacked.
No doubt some will see my proposal as a form of censorship, but it lets everyone have their say, little is deleted altogther, and it saves us all having to wade through individuals’ little spats.
Pardon me, but what does “registration” mean? Are you saying that people could only post if they first gave a valid home address and telephone number along with their e-mail address? Would the administrators then go door to door to verify the identity of those who registered?
It seems that even debating registration is untenable. True registration is impossible, or would reduce the size of those able to post to an artificially small level.
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Should we keep the Rants & Raves?
Yes, and given the title, people should be allowed to rant and rave. -
Should registration be required to post?
No, this is irrelevant since anyone can make up a fake identity. -
Should the discussions be moderated?
No, but if the discussions are moderated, the moderator should, if they are to have a shred of credibility, apply their decisions consistently. I think this is the key issue: the current moderators act, as noted by one person, in a “knee jerk” reaction. further, i get the “this is our site and we will do whatever we want” feeling here. that’s their “right”, but rather irresponsible, and i’m sure potential advertisers won’t like it one bit.
rants and raves could be seen as similar to the “letters to the editor” section of a newspaper: rules are established for the letter writers and enforced consistently by the editors. the key word is “consistently.”
anyone, on a positive note, i do enjoy reading these forums and have gotten decent info re: getting an apartment as well as on the history of and culture of taiwan.
I think if you look at the number of posts in general over the past week, you’ll realize that if R&R goes, the site’ll soon be virtually dead.
If you’re looking for ad revenue (and of course, maybe you’re not) you appear to be going about it the wrong way.
Seems to me that, unpleasant for you to stomach though it might be, R&R was the glue that held this thing together.
Rants and Rave should stay. It is an extremely useful forum. However, some moderation is inevitably necessary. On occasion there have been some rude postings. This is where the moderators should warn the user via e-mail or simply delete there post. However, this is very subjective and difficult to judge. What is ok and what is not? Personal attacks need to stop. There is no need for it. If you can post something in a constructive manner than it’s fine, but if you attacking someone personally just because they have a different opinion then you then it should be dealt with accordingly.
Someone said you should create a place where people could hold disputes so that the rest of us don’t have to read it. Great idea! An additional idea to that is that if anyone else cares enough to read there disputes then they should have to agree to some terms or conditions to view it. Maybe even create a branch account to view it or post to it. (yeah I know too many accounts, but…) This way no one can complain about what they read. I think you can call it Bickering.
You should have to register in one form or another to post. No more lurkers. Even if someone creates a dozen names, who cares, if they want to spend the time to do it, so be it, but someone who is just browsing the web should not be allowed to post anything! I still think that the forums should be kept on a separate account to protect identities.
Putting a post in a wrong forum should not be deleted, but it should be moved.
i think i agree with whoever it was that said the stuff about life being life a pastery thats really not quite so much a sort of glazed baked good but more really an empty bottle of that power drink stuff with the cigarette butts in the bottom and the little well theyre not maggots i dont think but some kind of fruit fly larvae squirming around the top of it
its easy, in this crazy world, to make a pot of rice and to neglect it. sure, we’ve all done it - i mean, life is short, and rice is so cheap that it’s easy to just say “hey, rice, you don’t matter to me. to ME. to ME.” well, sometimes its important to just take a step back and say, hey, y’know, that rice was once some rice mommys baby.
so the next time you’re taking a taxi, why not give the poor bastard a fiver or maybe some betel nut you found on the mrt? because you know what they say: red toothed grins are infectious.
so too is the hivvy. so don’t forget to wrap your willy, or at the very least to heavily spray whatever hole youre about to penetrate with a goodly amount of lysol or dettrol to properly disinfect. especially in the subtropics where weird genital worms and stuff are so rampant. can you imagine going to take a pee and seeing worms dingle out of your dangle what a friggin trip that would be! jayzus!
YIKES!
bottom line: rants and raves are
One more thing. Seems obvious now that R&R is not going to disappear. Its going to continue whether or not there’s a forum specifically named for the purpose. I think having the R&R forum would be much less annoying than the alternative – people ranting, raving and flaming on ALL the forums (not ME, of course, with the corresponding increased moderation this would entail on all those boards.
I’d just like to add that about my quick spew on free speech, yeah, it still requires some moderation and policing as many others have been saying. I think that sort of control should be applied to the “posting arguments” where people start the tear at the others throats. But if it is just heckling about society, Taiwan, whatever, wherever, that is okay. Plus one more thing, I think that many people put too much emotion into the meaning behind a bunch of words on the internet. You to be openminded and remember, the way a person writes might not portray their true meaning. If you notice the lilts in oral communication. Some speech can mean different things if spoken with different tones.
Gus & Christine,
- YES. Please keep the R&R Forum
- YES. Quick registration process OK.
- YES. Minimal moderation is necessary.
Overall, I am one of those individuals who believes there is no such thing as true freedom when you live in a community of more than one person. Huh? What I am saying is… if someone wants to post in this Forum, they should respect a few rules of the community (I think it was Rousseau who described the whole limits of community living better). You have every right to layout the vision of this community, moderate discussions, require a registration process to encourage some accountability, and nurture the way you would like the Forum to “mature”.
Personal attacks and plain rude comments with no constructive content should be filtered. If you are going to filter, please provide explanations and remain consistent with the spirit of your original policies. Policies can be fine-tuned to grow with the changing times (living document like a constitution??). Hey, a little discipline never hurt anyone (shit, I am sounding alot like my father now !).
This view will likely piss off many libertarians out there, but, I am assuming they are not the major users of this forum. Just maybe the loudest. Life aint fair.
Good luck with your final decision. You have this “issue” to deal with simply because you are the custodians (and bill payers) of a very popular forum that is experiencing some growing pains. IMHO, that is a GOOD problem. Please continue the great work on this most excellent web site.
CG
Up a ways Jody Lin listed some people she liked reading who seem to have disappeared since some ‘outrageous’ postings started to appear in Rants and Raves. I,“v”, was one of the people she mentioned. She ventured that these postings were causing us not to come. I can only speak for myself. I get a kick out of outrageuos postings. The reason I don’t come here as much as the others is because I’m busy.I am a full-time teacher here in the US and I also have to take care of my two little girls aged 5 and 3. If you count my 38 year old Taiwanese husband who refuses to learn enough English to deal with talking to doctors and handling bills etc, I have 3 children to deal with (school here closed for the summer on 6/22, so I’ll be coming more to bother y’all). I think people should be able to say whatever they want to say here as long as it doesn’t hurt anyone. No one’s real name/address/telephone number/email should be posted without their permission. Rumors and insinuation about a person identified with their real name should not be allowed- for one thing,this could potentially hurt their job prospects in Taiwan if they live in Taiwan (I’m in the US). If someone feels they have a really good reason to stongly criticize someone by real name (as opposed to ‘net name’)publically, this poster should identify themselves by name and email and gus and christine should double check to see if the name and email given is correct. Maybe a woman wants to identify a date rapist who the wheels of justice in Taiwan never get around to crushing (I’m not talking about run-of-the-mill name-calling/put-downs/etc criticisms, which are often funny and conversation starters). Also, the moderators shouldn’t allow postings from people who seem like they are trying to lure others into questionable meetings. Zhongwen.com had a problem with an asshole who at his mildest was simply crude, but who may have also been a sexual predator. During chats he would try to flatter femailes, get their emails and get them to visit him in private chat rooms where, according to him, he would set up ‘dates’. Zhongwen.com dealt with this by having a warning in the chat room that reminded people never to meet alone with people they met thru chat. Anyway, my bottom line is if oriented wants to be a true community forum, the moderators should pretty much leave us to ourselves. On the other hand,if oriented.org wants to eventually become an oriented.COM or spin off other services for profit, then the moderators have to consider what kind of moderating will bring in the kind of customers they want. If they want customers of a certain profile (young professionals with money, for example), it might be to their benefit to skew their moderating to attract these people. Then again, I really don’t know if or how gus and christine plan to make money off their website.-v 
I just posted my esteemed opinion and can’t find what happened to it.-v
I hope that the moderators can keep the rants and raves section of this forum. Yes, there are people who abuse it, and the site does “belong” to someone who can do with it as she pleases; but I think this forum serves as a very good outlet and community resource.
To cut down on the abuse, I would suggest more closely monitoring new posts, and perhaps enlisting more people to help moderate the discussions.
Hi, everybody.
I just want to say - yummy bubbles and shiny rainbow happies for all your lolly puffkins!
Love,
Fluffy Lovely
Hey, folks.
Just got bored and thought I’d drop on in. Am I allowed to enter Rants and Raves in T-Shirt and shorts?
Is there a dress code?
I don’t know, I’m feeling kind of uncomfortable. I thought there was a rave going on, but it looks like a cocktail party. And I didn’t even comb my hair. Well, I’ll just put my flip flops on and get outta here - I gotta be somewhere at 11.
See ya later.
Please keep Rants and Raves, it is the best forum of all. Keep it unmoderated, if possible. I think it is good people express their views and disagreements, that’s the beauty of it!
Thanks
Susana
Of course you should keep the R & R forum. And of course it should be unmoderated. Its ridiculous that all the thin-skinned people start crying the moment someone disagrees with them or says something with an angry tone. The forum is called RANTS and RAVES. Its perfect for expressing our dissatisfaction etc.
And Musasa, if you disagree so much with what is going on, stick to your own bloody forum.
1 - YES, because it’s lovely
2 - NO, because everybody know knows that I’m Fluffy Lovely
3 - NO, because that’s my PUFFY! You go moderate your own puff wums!
PUFF!
Fluffy Lovely